An Interview with Katie Herzig (Part 3)

This is the third in a three-part interview with singer/songwriter Katie Herzig. You can read parts one and two.

There’s a lot in “Apple Tree” about searching for love – I’m intrigued by some of those themes that come through on this album.

“Hologram” talks about understanding how to get close to people, and it’s quite pessimistic about it all, while at the same understanding that part of growing is pain and honesty. “Sumatra” and “How the West Was Won” are more about looking to the future, being more vulnerable and open. Those songs are a lot less exhausting to sing, but they explore the opposite of what “Hologram” is about.

And even though they’re honest, they’re not exhausting.  I know some people put a lot of emotion into their performance – is that something you do, or does the song speaks for itself emotionally?

Sometimes I’m not really connected with what I’m saying – I’m singing and experiencing the song, but not experiencing everything it’s saying. Maybe I’m thinking about what song I’m going to be playing next, or the distracted person in the back of the room. But sometimes, in live shows, there are moments when you’re connected with the song and where it came from, and it takes you to that moment. That’s the blessing and the curse, depending on where you were when you wrote it.

Your newest album is entitled “Apple Tree”, but that isn’t the name of a song. Instead, it’s an image that appears in three different songs on the album.  Does that image hold a particular significance for you?

It does, and it’s hard to explain. First of all, I didn’t realize that I mention an apple tree in three songs until I was mixing the record. I don’t know how that happened.

But when you’re writing songs, you go through phases of using similar images. But in “Songbird”, in the lyrics “I am a songbird / Singing out your windows / Telling stories in the shade”, the tree feels sort of like a platform or a stage, but with a life of its own. That might seem random, but it definitely came out in this record, and when I realized it was in three of the songs, it felt like the most natural title.

What’s your songwriting process like?  How do you work your way into a song?

Most of the time, I write with an instrument in my hand and either a pad of paper or a computer in front of me. A lot of times I’ll just press “record” and start singing something. For me, it’s mostly based on starting with a musical and melodic place that feels interesting – otherwise I don’t want to stay there. So I make things up, and lines come out that I have to write down. That sets up rules for the song, and then I fill it out. Sometimes there is something inside that is clear, and I can say it so easily because it’s on the tip of my tongue, but other times you know there’s something there but you have to spend a little more time with it. Those are the songs where I get to the end and I’m grateful that something came out of it. It’s more of an act of listening rather than speaking – like tapping into something really beautiful and meaningful.

Finally getting out of the way and listening, like you said.

Any time you can. Sometimes you just know that you’re in that zone, and that whatever’s going to come out is going to be special, and other times you’re not. Part of the process is identifying when you’re in that place.

Do you have ways, or times of day, or habits or processes to try and create opportunity for that to happen, to put yourself in that place?

If you’d asked me a couple years ago, I would have said I was freer with my words at night, when I should be sleeping. But since I put my record out, the kind of creating and writing I’ve done has been more co-writing than writing on my own. The things I’ve written on my own have been for specific purposes, like when I was asked to write a song for the Sex and the City movie. It was so much fun, because I always thought I would enjoy seeing a scene and then creating music that fit it. I was flooded with ideas that I recorded, and one was used for the soundtrack. I’ve had others since then that I’ve been trying to develop – it was such a rare and different way of creating music, a breath of fresh air to create music that’s not a statement about who you are, or the kind of song that Katie Herzig would write.

That song doesn’t really sound like you – there’s a lot of programming and drum machine going on. It has the potential to become the next club scene hit.  I know you have a proclivity for pop music; was that a way you wanted to go, or was that only a fun excursion?

I believe it’s both. I had never written a song where that didn’t involve a guitar or piano. On this, I would build drum loops, then play bass lines and fill in around that. For this specific song, I was trying to follow what they had loved about a Fergie song they’d temped in, so it was pushing me into those “guilty pleasure” places that I enjoyed working on. I could never play that song live, so it’s not a realistic style for me. When I started getting swept up in creating that song and others around it, I started to think, Oh gosh, what am I doing, I am totally changing – having a bit of an identity crisis. But I’ve found a way since then to massage myself into something in between. There will always be people that prefer my first, most acoustic record, and I’ll dabble in different kinds of production based on songs, as well as my influences at the time. But there was something about the Sex and the City thing that was freeing, knowing that I could go there and not be caught up in what people might think about it. It was a very specific creation for something very specific, and I know it has influenced me, but I don’t think it will take over what I’ve already laid down for myself.

No, I don’t think anyone’s worried about that. You’ve had a lot of songs end up in TV shows and movies, even since your first solo album.  Who do you have to thank for that?  Who does the leg work?

My first TV placement was on Smallville, because a high school friend works for the show. I’ve worked with companies that represent artists to music supervisors for film and TV placements. The company I’m working with now is great. But I traced back my first Grey’s Anatomy placement last year – a few people showed up at a Hotel Café show that I did last year, and told me they were the reason I was on the show. Apparently they heard me on KCRW, and one of them was working as an editor on the show. So some of it comes from connections, and some of it comes from your music just being out there. It’s a good way to get your music heard and also make some money.

You’ve been on tour all fall. What do you do while on the road to stay plugged into the community back home, as opposed to burning out on the road?

The community in Nashville is made up of people who understand when you disappear for a while on tour and then come back and become part of the community again. It’s always been hard for me to get locked into a group, because I’m gone a lot. But it’s important to just let people know you’re back and make an effort to connect. It’s hard, though, when you leave. Each time, I learn how hard it is, because you’re in a groove at home, then a groove on the road, and when you get home it takes a couple days to adjust and become re-connected.

You mentioned earlier that you weren’t conscious of “apple tree” showing up several times in the lyrics, and I was wondering about two of the other ones that stuck out at me. One was birds singing out windows, which came up in both “Songbird” and “Shovel”.  Light was another one – “light on your feet” (I Want to Belong to You), “waiting for the dark to make it’s way back into the light” (How the West Was Won), “someday meeting in the light” (Sumatra), “catch the breeze that moves you to the sunlight” (Gypsy Girl), “the light is always on you / always in the light” (Shovel).

I had no idea! That’s so funny. Well, I guess that’s place that encompasses joy and wisdom and knowledge and all those good things. Lightness is like that, and darkness is a harder place. I guess that’s my non-specific way of alluding to something good.